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	<title>Comments on: Sox Diary: 10-20-04</title>
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	<link>http://www.ephblog.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/</link>
	<description>All Things Eph</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 13:36:22 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Derek</title>
		<link>http://www.ephblog.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/comment-page-1/#comment-1079</link>
		<dc:creator>Derek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Oct 2004 20:06:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ephblog.dreamhosters.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/#comment-1079</guid>
		<description>Sam  --
I'm not certain when you got to establish what the litmus test for respect is. I have thousands of words indicating both my loathing and my respect for the Yankees. My credentials here are clear. I do not need to wish you luck on the Ephblog comment boards for that.
Thanks for the congrats. Four wins to go.
dc
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sam  &#8211;<br />
I&#8217;m not certain when you got to establish what the litmus test for respect is. I have thousands of words indicating both my loathing and my respect for the Yankees. My credentials here are clear. I do not need to wish you luck on the Ephblog comment boards for that.<br />
Thanks for the congrats. Four wins to go.<br />
dc</p>
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		<title>By: Sam</title>
		<link>http://www.ephblog.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/comment-page-1/#comment-1078</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Oct 2004 16:36:23 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>But you still could not bring yourself to wish us luck...

Congratualtions are due; so, Congratulations.  The Red Sox are the better team this year.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But you still could not bring yourself to wish us luck&#8230;</p>
<p>Congratualtions are due; so, Congratulations.  The Red Sox are the better team this year.</p>
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		<title>By: Derek</title>
		<link>http://www.ephblog.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/comment-page-1/#comment-1077</link>
		<dc:creator>Derek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Oct 2004 14:56:22 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I do not need to point out for literate people that the example of "dehumanization that was used was m reference to Yankee Stadium as "The Toilet Bowl." Idiocy is not a virtue, folks. I'd appreciate someone pointing out to the kids who arrived on the short bus that it is pretty difficult to dehumanize an inanimate object.
Enjoy the off season.

dc
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do not need to point out for literate people that the example of &#8220;dehumanization that was used was m reference to Yankee Stadium as &#8220;The Toilet Bowl.&#8221; Idiocy is not a virtue, folks. I&#8217;d appreciate someone pointing out to the kids who arrived on the short bus that it is pretty difficult to dehumanize an inanimate object.<br />
Enjoy the off season.</p>
<p>dc</p>
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		<title>By: Henry</title>
		<link>http://www.ephblog.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/comment-page-1/#comment-1076</link>
		<dc:creator>Henry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Oct 2004 05:11:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>This is madness.
As a Yankee fan and New Yorker who is rooting for the Red Sox in this series, I couldn't help but add to these histrionics.  It's laughable that a Red Sox fan is impugning the behavior of Yankee fans.  Both teams have a 'passionate' following, but it's my observation that while love for the team largely motivates the rabid Yankee fan, hatred of the evil-other (dare I say, dehumanized?) Yankees largely motivates the rabid Red Sox fan (I know this has been said before millions of times).  Witness a regular season game in the Bronx with the Yankees trailing the Sox, the cheers are mainly "Let's go Yankees;" in Fenway, with the tables turned, the cheers resound "Yankees Suck."  This all leads back to the fundamental problem at the heart of the Yankee-Red Sox rivalry.  The Yankees have been blessed with the history, talent, heart and soul, and yes, resources that have created the so-called "Yankee evil-empire."  The Red Sox have been similarly blessed, and retain the support of the "Red Sox nation."  But so much of this national identity has grown in opposition to all things Yankee.  It's natural that Red Sox fans would develop into small-minded jingoists and eternal victims.  I support the Red Sox because they are the better team, they have the heart and soul that has faded from the Yankees of the past decade.  I hope that the Sox can overcome their true curse:  the rancor and parochialism that has come to define the Red Sox nation.  Besides, the hairy barbarians of the North have been known to have their due.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is madness.<br />
As a Yankee fan and New Yorker who is rooting for the Red Sox in this series, I couldn&#8217;t help but add to these histrionics.  It&#8217;s laughable that a Red Sox fan is impugning the behavior of Yankee fans.  Both teams have a &#8216;passionate&#8217; following, but it&#8217;s my observation that while love for the team largely motivates the rabid Yankee fan, hatred of the evil-other (dare I say, dehumanized?) Yankees largely motivates the rabid Red Sox fan (I know this has been said before millions of times).  Witness a regular season game in the Bronx with the Yankees trailing the Sox, the cheers are mainly &#8220;Let&#8217;s go Yankees;&#8221; in Fenway, with the tables turned, the cheers resound &#8220;Yankees Suck.&#8221;  This all leads back to the fundamental problem at the heart of the Yankee-Red Sox rivalry.  The Yankees have been blessed with the history, talent, heart and soul, and yes, resources that have created the so-called &#8220;Yankee evil-empire.&#8221;  The Red Sox have been similarly blessed, and retain the support of the &#8220;Red Sox nation.&#8221;  But so much of this national identity has grown in opposition to all things Yankee.  It&#8217;s natural that Red Sox fans would develop into small-minded jingoists and eternal victims.  I support the Red Sox because they are the better team, they have the heart and soul that has faded from the Yankees of the past decade.  I hope that the Sox can overcome their true curse:  the rancor and parochialism that has come to define the Red Sox nation.  Besides, the hairy barbarians of the North have been known to have their due.</p>
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		<title>By: Derek</title>
		<link>http://www.ephblog.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/comment-page-1/#comment-1075</link>
		<dc:creator>Derek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Oct 2004 23:16:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ephblog.dreamhosters.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/#comment-1075</guid>
		<description>Wow. As if I needed exhibit A to reveal Yankee fan inanity, here it comes, on the Ephblog comment boards.

"Dehumanization"? Really? Let me tell you something, Sam, as a scholar of race and politics in the US and Africa, I've seen and know what dehumanization is. Let's pretend to be bright enough to be able to differentiate gibes from "dehumanization." Let's pretend that  you are informed enough to know that calling something  "The Toilet Bowl in the Bronx" is not akin to actual dehumanization. Let's pretend, ok? Genocide in Rwanda, the Langa Massacre, the beatings of the Freedom Riders, those are examples of dehumanization. If you undersatnd sports so little that you really are not familiar with the back and forth, especially between yankees and Red Sox fans, and if you cannot grasp the emotionalism that ties into all of this, you probably ought to be leaving your whiny comments elsewhere. If you think my pieces are "sophomoric" don't read them. I hate to drop this little intelligence on you, but I am not writing for your validation. To quote Sox GM Lou Gorman from many years ago when he was asked about Roger Clemens' late arrival for spring training, whether you show up or not, the sun will rise, the sun will set, and I'll have lunch.

As for "as sophisticated as it gets in the Fens," I'll take that one personally. If you want to do the intellectual sophistication mano a mano throwdown, I'll take that little Pepsi Challenge. But then I guess you must have been playing your Mahler albums and lamenting Derrida's passage last night when the police had to step out in riot gear to ring the stadium from those sophisticates in the Bronx who were throwing baseballs at the players and umps on the field.

As for my acknowledgement of the Yankees and what they have accomplished, I think I've granted their status and their place often enough on my Diary entries without breaking down and bowing before the shrine. At the same time to say that beating the Yankees is more important to us than winning it all, I'll tell you what -- you probably ought to speak for yourself first, Yankee fans second, and try to speak for me not at all. That we'll be going through the Yankees will make it all the sweeter, yes.  That you really think that what I have said about the Yankees is "dehumanizing" makes me think that at least my perspective is being skewed by sports fan emotionalism, but that perhaps you need a passport and a newspaper subscription. May I recommend a trip to Harare?

I thank you for your constructive criticisms.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow. As if I needed exhibit A to reveal Yankee fan inanity, here it comes, on the Ephblog comment boards.</p>
<p>&#8220;Dehumanization&#8221;? Really? Let me tell you something, Sam, as a scholar of race and politics in the US and Africa, I&#8217;ve seen and know what dehumanization is. Let&#8217;s pretend to be bright enough to be able to differentiate gibes from &#8220;dehumanization.&#8221; Let&#8217;s pretend that  you are informed enough to know that calling something  &#8220;The Toilet Bowl in the Bronx&#8221; is not akin to actual dehumanization. Let&#8217;s pretend, ok? Genocide in Rwanda, the Langa Massacre, the beatings of the Freedom Riders, those are examples of dehumanization. If you undersatnd sports so little that you really are not familiar with the back and forth, especially between yankees and Red Sox fans, and if you cannot grasp the emotionalism that ties into all of this, you probably ought to be leaving your whiny comments elsewhere. If you think my pieces are &#8220;sophomoric&#8221; don&#8217;t read them. I hate to drop this little intelligence on you, but I am not writing for your validation. To quote Sox GM Lou Gorman from many years ago when he was asked about Roger Clemens&#8217; late arrival for spring training, whether you show up or not, the sun will rise, the sun will set, and I&#8217;ll have lunch.</p>
<p>As for &#8220;as sophisticated as it gets in the Fens,&#8221; I&#8217;ll take that one personally. If you want to do the intellectual sophistication mano a mano throwdown, I&#8217;ll take that little Pepsi Challenge. But then I guess you must have been playing your Mahler albums and lamenting Derrida&#8217;s passage last night when the police had to step out in riot gear to ring the stadium from those sophisticates in the Bronx who were throwing baseballs at the players and umps on the field.</p>
<p>As for my acknowledgement of the Yankees and what they have accomplished, I think I&#8217;ve granted their status and their place often enough on my Diary entries without breaking down and bowing before the shrine. At the same time to say that beating the Yankees is more important to us than winning it all, I&#8217;ll tell you what &#8212; you probably ought to speak for yourself first, Yankee fans second, and try to speak for me not at all. That we&#8217;ll be going through the Yankees will make it all the sweeter, yes.  That you really think that what I have said about the Yankees is &#8220;dehumanizing&#8221; makes me think that at least my perspective is being skewed by sports fan emotionalism, but that perhaps you need a passport and a newspaper subscription. May I recommend a trip to Harare?</p>
<p>I thank you for your constructive criticisms.</p>
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		<title>By: Sam</title>
		<link>http://www.ephblog.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/comment-page-1/#comment-1074</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Oct 2004 22:58:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Your dehumanization of all things Yankees is truly breathtaking and depressing.  One would hope that a man of your education and intellect could rise above such sophomoric turns of phrase as "the Toilet Bowl."  But, then again, "Yankees Suck" is about as sophisticated as it gets in the Fens.

So, what if the Yankees lose?  All of us reasonable Yankees fans must face that possibility.  If we do, you will claim historical redemption and, truth be told, you would have a measure of it.  But not a whole measure.  2004 is one year; one year in which the Red Sox might beat the Yankees (which seems to be the Holy Grail, more important than the World Series...).  And if they win, hurrah for them (you see, we can find humanity in our adversaries).  But when we step back and look at the grand sweep of History (your field, no?) we can find some comfort. By any objective standard, the Yankees are the greatest baseball team of all time.  They have won more World Series than any other team, and lost more than most teams have even played in.  We win; we lose; but the accumulated excellence of one hundred years keeps us afloat in the most difficlt of times.

So, I say good luck to you.  Can you say the same to me?

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your dehumanization of all things Yankees is truly breathtaking and depressing.  One would hope that a man of your education and intellect could rise above such sophomoric turns of phrase as &#8220;the Toilet Bowl.&#8221;  But, then again, &#8220;Yankees Suck&#8221; is about as sophisticated as it gets in the Fens.</p>
<p>So, what if the Yankees lose?  All of us reasonable Yankees fans must face that possibility.  If we do, you will claim historical redemption and, truth be told, you would have a measure of it.  But not a whole measure.  2004 is one year; one year in which the Red Sox might beat the Yankees (which seems to be the Holy Grail, more important than the World Series&#8230;).  And if they win, hurrah for them (you see, we can find humanity in our adversaries).  But when we step back and look at the grand sweep of History (your field, no?) we can find some comfort. By any objective standard, the Yankees are the greatest baseball team of all time.  They have won more World Series than any other team, and lost more than most teams have even played in.  We win; we lose; but the accumulated excellence of one hundred years keeps us afloat in the most difficlt of times.</p>
<p>So, I say good luck to you.  Can you say the same to me?</p>
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		<title>By: Derek</title>
		<link>http://www.ephblog.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/comment-page-1/#comment-1073</link>
		<dc:creator>Derek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Oct 2004 22:44:06 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Correction made. Brainfart on my part. Good eye. ARod is a cheater.
dc
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correction made. Brainfart on my part. Good eye. ARod is a cheater.<br />
dc</p>
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		<title>By: David Kane</title>
		<link>http://www.ephblog.com/2004/10/20/sox-diary-10-20-04/comment-page-1/#comment-1072</link>
		<dc:creator>David Kane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Oct 2004 22:35:02 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Beautifully written.

Small correction: Jeter returned to first after Rodriguez was called out for interfence. I *think* that the rule here is that all runners return to where they started after any interference call.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Beautifully written.</p>
<p>Small correction: Jeter returned to first after Rodriguez was called out for interfence. I *think* that the rule here is that all runners return to where they started after any interference call.</p>
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