Thu 9 Oct 2008
Crunch time for Williams in New York is next week. (Read our archives for background and these two Record articles.) The Record reports:
Debate regarding the continuation of the Williams in New York Program (WNY) will revive in the upcoming months, with extensive discussion scheduled for the Oct. 15 faculty meeting and a final decision planned for the Nov. 12 meeting. Faculty voted to table the motion at its meeting in May, where dialogue quickly revealed the complex issues underlying the decision.
I don’t have much to add beyond my previous commentary. Highlights:
1) A central concern with WNY is that it is not really WNY so much as Robert-Jackall-NY. Professor Jackall deserves all the credit for creating this wonderful program, but it needs to be designed to go on without him. Moreover, it is probably suspect for it to be overly “sociological” in its approach. One way to view the entire debate is as a method for Morty to force the program to get serious about its permanent structure.
2) There are two plausible permanent structures. First, we could make it just like Williams-in-Oxford. Students arrange whatever classes they like with the help of a single Williams faculty member who contracts out with either NYU or even a collection of adjuncts. There is much to be said for such a model. Second, we could institute a “standard” curriculum that would be constant from year-to-year. Course 1 would be the internships and associated discussions/presentations, as now. (Whether or not this is usefully described as “field work” is a different question.) Course 2 would be all about New York, originally designed by Marissa Doran ‘05. I can’t find the syllabus for this class, but it provided a wonderful tour of the history of New York City. Course 3 would be what? Suggestions welcome! Course 4 would be left to the discretion of whatever faculty member was in residence.
The problem with the current structure is that, each year, too much of the course work changes, too much is dependent on the interests of whatever faculty member happens to be there. I think (correctly) that this is a key reason for some of the popularity problems that WNY has faced.
3) Although I would vote to keep WNY, I worry about what is coming. If Morty really loved the program, its continuation would be assured. Yet costs are a real issue, despite the fact that the Waters Report handles the topic clumsily. If Morty does not like the program and is worried about spending (and you can sure of the latter), then how can it be saved? I think that the proponents of WNY need to be much more specific about how they see the program working over the next decade.
I had an e-mail exchange with a student involved in the lobbying effort last year. He graciously allowed me to quote him anonymously. Below are his comments.
These are somewhat disjointed since they are copied from a series of e-mails exchanged last year. Apologies for the delay, but I hope that future historians with thank me! Lots of good insider details. Bullish signs: Getting support from important alumni like Herb Allen ’62 and Peter Willmott ’59. Bearish signs: No public support from Morty.
To preface [last year's faculty] meeting, Morty introduced Chris Waters. Morty did not speak on the merits of the program nor the report. Waters defended his report in the wake of many attacks on it. EJ Johnson, Bob Jackall, and Liza Johnson then gave impassioned defenses of the program on many grounds, mostly focusing on the fieldwork component and its academic merit. Morty then opened the floor to faculty comments. George Marcus immediately raised many questions and criticisms of the report, focusing primarily on the methodology. He moved to table the motion. Morty wished to keep the discussion going, but Marcus reminded him that rules declared that a motion to table must be voted upon immediately. Debate began on the motion to table with a few professors arguing they were in favor of the motion, and Waters and Laura Heatherington arguing in favor of debating the motion immediately. The motion to table passed by a margin of roughly 67-59.
[More details, please.]
Waters’ first point concerned student feedback. He said that students from the first 3 semesters of the program were consulted via written testimonials and, given the incredible length of these testimonials, further interviews were not necessary. He also attacked Jackall’s allegation that he only interviewed 2 students prior to fall 07, claiming he interviewed all but 2 (6) and that Jackall would have realized this had he spoken with Waters. Unfortunately for Waters, his report spoke of 2 interviews of the sort.
EJ focused primarily on the fieldwork component. He spoke about his experience as a ARTH professor and how that rebuts the report’s point that fieldwork is primarily a sociological discipline. He discussed how the fieldwork could be administered by any professor at Williams and that the experience was incredibly rewarding for himself as well as his students. His speech, by my judgment, was incredibly effective and well-done.
Jackall’s points were mostly extensions of the document he distributed to refute the Waters report. I have attached said document. He also addressed the above Waters point, stating that the language which Waters argued against was in fact written in his own committee’s report. He also spoke extensively as to his students’ experiences with fieldwork and their value in educational development.
Liza Johnson spoke on a number of issues, among which were her support for the program, the future of the program, the successful adjunct professors whom she has recruited, and how her experience as an ARTS professor refutes the reports’ point that fieldwork is exclusively a SOC discipline.
Marcus’s points are as follows:
1) How does this cost analysis compare to Oxford-Williams? More, less, the same? [What is included in Appendix four is not useful since the data are not comparable - capital costs are not included in the Oxford numbers for example.]
2) How does this assessment of student experience compare to Oxford-Williams? What is the pedagogic value of the Oxford program (to use as a benchmark to assess the claim in the report that the pedagogic value of a program should be weighed in the decision to continue the Williams in NY program)? Is it more or less than education at Williams in Williamstown (which now also has a rich tutorial program)? What dimensions of “pedagogic value” did the committee apply to come to its conclusion?
3) The report argues that additional administrative support is required but offers nothing to give a concrete sense of what roles are required to be played and by whom. Hence this point is left rather as an assertion of limited authority. Since other colleges have similar programs why not do a comparison of jobs/functions?
4) What was the performance of these students (those in the program) before and after their semester? Was it improved, left largely similar to before, or become less capable? And, how does that compare to students who stay on campus and to those who participate in other semesters off campus programs? Or to put it more straightforwardly, was participation in the Williams in New York program helpful, or not, in shaping the subsequent educational experience of those students who participated?
5) The report mentions that students who participated were, in the main, laudatory about the program but gives very limited details as to what the specific merit they found in their experience (i.e., were same benefits reported and among what percentages, or where there different benefits, some perhaps in tension with others, reported but not widely shared?). Nor does the report say how precisely the students assessments were obtained (explicit evaluations on provided dimensions of analysis, or just solicited anecdotal reports).
6) The complaint about “lack of curricular coherence” is left rather under-nourished – why is this relevant? Do we ask this of students in other semesters (both those on and off campus)? Since when is there supposed to be an “overarching unity” to a curriculum? Certainly that is not apparent in the campus curriculum (indeed the history of the curriculum on this campus over the years is a steady trend away from “unity” however understood).
7) Why so shy on reporting who is in favor and who is opposed? Is that a state secret?
8) What was the experience with the retention of valued placements over the period of time of the pilot program? Was there a high or low turnover? No details at all thereon.
9) The prospect for continuing in a modified fashion is left rather vague (to put the point mildly). Why not provide a fuller (and thereby) adequate depiction of what a vital program would look like – something more than sixteen students, taking over the Williams Club, and adding some administrative support)?
10) The report notes, properly, that the supply of interested and able faculty to serve and to serve as faculty directors, is a critical consideration. The report goes on to say that it has doubts about whether the faculty required would be sufficient to sustain the program but offers nothing about the methodology of how they reached that conclusion.
…
As far as the lobbying: a group of students (about 10) split up mealtime hours to gather signatures for petitions outside of Paresky. We also contacted our professors through all methods—face-to-face, email, and phone. I’ll stress that it was not only WNY alumni who contacted professors; I have heard from many students not affiliated with the program who did the same because they felt strongly that the program was important to Williams. I personally spoke to about 15 professors. They were very receptive; in general, they appreciated my efforts to fill them in on parts that may have been lacking the report, and they agreed that the report (and the time in which it was produced) were not sufficient for a fair termination of a program.
…
And as far as lobbying is concerned, we finished with 820 signatures to our petition, including many high-profile alumni (including Herb Allen ’62 and Peter Willmott ’59). I feel it was very successful and that the show of support influenced the faculty in their decision.
What do readers hear about faculty opinion? Gossip please!
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15 Responses to “WNY Updates”
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November 12th, 2008 at 5:51 pm
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hwc says:
I don’t think that WNY has suffered “popularity” problems. The notion that there should be dozens of students interested is simply not realistic.
Rough numbers, only 210 or so of each graduating class at Williams spends a full semester abroad — almost always during fall or spring of Junior year. WNY has already been getting 8% of those. How much more popular could it be to attract an even higher percentage away from the incredible options abroad? How many more students does Williams College want to talk out of studying abroad in the 21st century?
October 10th, 2008 at 12:45 amLarry George says:
This is extremely helpful, Dave. Thank you for taking the time and effort to piece the emailed information together. Please pass on my gratitude to the anonymous person who originally provided the information.
Whatever comes of this, I am grateful to the students, faculty, and alumni who fought to make sure that the program received a fair, unrushed analysis. Rushing the report and presumably the killing of the program through, as seemed about to happen, would have been quite a disservice not only to the program but, even more importantly to me, to Williams.
I don’t want to be personal about this, but, after reading the committee report last spring, I was quite disappointed in the faculty committee’s leadership. Reading between the lines in a lot of places (and reinforced after reading the notes posted above), it appears that the directive may have come from on high either to get rid of the program or to change it radically according to some rather hidden agenda. Are they rewriting their report to take into account the many reasonable questions, comments, and criticisms that the first report and the faculty meeting generated? I very much hope so – not the least to give the community a better view of the committee members’ abilities.
October 10th, 2008 at 1:53 pmJonathan '05 says:
Excellent collection of facts, good job engaging a current student.
Smiled to see Robert’s Rules in action:
Ah, the power play of delivering your speech with a pre-empting motion at the end. The Motion to Lay on the Table is strangely powerful: it requires only a majority, is undebatable as noted by the mover at this meeting, and can effectively kill a motion that is not brought back later in the meeting.
Morty, assuming he was acting as chair, did wrong in allowing debate on the motion to table. But if Marcus was wishing to “table until October 15″ then his motion was truly a motion to postpone, which needs a supermajority and is debatable. A clever chair may have gotten Marcus to rephrase his motion, though if Marcus knew tabling was undebatable he probably would have known better.
October 10th, 2008 at 4:16 pmkthomas says:
Good to see Robert’s Rules being employed and followed: I like to make the point that if we can’t manage democracy at a place like Williams, we can’t manage it as a nation.
We went over this a little last time round, but the dispute about fieldwork seems to me an oddly distorted “academic” “turf” battle: I’m coming over here because I’m in the middle of writing a (brief) overview of the state and challenges of a subset IT firms in Nashville– and because it struck me that I’ve spent the last year doing an informal “survey” of the different firms around me, and how their “culture” has adapted to the various challenges– from commercial possibilities to organization to workforce environment– each forming quite different responses. It’s really hard to miss the “Bob Jackall” “fieldwork” inspired component to this– and lots of my life– but it’s hard to miss all the other disciplines that are mixed in and absolutely necessary– Psychology, History, to, of course, Computer Science and Mathematics.
If you don’t know a enough of the Psychology — or the Comp Sci– you can’t evaluate the situation and culture, can’t do the “fieldwork.” If you don’t grasp the basic methods of analysis from Sociology, in contra-position, I don’t really think you can understand what’s going on in the programming tasks, or the psychological situation and challenges of the individuals.
To take my obligatory weekly shot at Stanley Fish: they’re not distinct and separable areas or functions– they’re all intermixed, with no sharp borders between.
To channel Chris Waters, from his seminar on method for history majors: the modern discipline of History began with the realization that you could mix historical narrative of events with economic history– and from there, you get psychological histories, environmental histories, technological histories, social histories… the whole, wonderful tableau of History (cf. Gould’s “Wonderful Life,” which is both a work of Palentology and History and many other disciplines).
From this perspective, I would declare that the statement that “fieldwork” does not apply or stretch to the other disciplines is simply specious.
In Bob’s terms, this is “the fundamental unity of all the Humanities”– where ‘the Humanites’ is more the general term Wissenschaefen, all the Faculties. I’ve been dismayed to see the academy in the US and Europe proceed apace at producing highly trained “intelligent idiots”– narrowing further into subspecialities (I know professors who fight over who “owns” scholarship regarding a small series of towns in 4,500 BC Samaria!) an a multiplication of what CP Snow termed “the two cultures” into a multitude of sub-cultures, each insular and parochial for no genuine or ‘objective’ reason, each, in the end, incapable of– and opposed to– understanding the basic and fundamental insights of the other cultures.
Williams, like Deep Springs, has resisted this tide but it is inevitable so long as the Professors are produced and socialized in the cultures of the major graduate schools, and align their efforts and careers to the pressures of the national market– and we should at least worry that this is one area where majority rule, and the judgment of numbers, would fail us.
Let me suggest something that a consulting firm told UCSC in its evaluation two decades ago: professors, above all, should not self-select themselves in hiring. I know I speak blasphemy to many, but allowing departments to self-select according to their own ‘criteria’ is insular, narrow-minded and corrupt: other faculty in other departments should be equally involved, as should the community, and this would change everything.
To those who will claim that only specialists can judge and select specialists– well, first, are you technicians?– and where else in the “professions” do you see such a practice?– but above all, if you cannot explain– if you are not explaining — your selves to others in a manner that will guarantee effective and fair decisions, you’re failing by the fundamental historical definition of what it is you do: not a narrow and technical task, but to Profess a Disciple, a Faculty among the Faculties of the world, a way, and all the ways, of understanding, of grasping and interpreting reality– and while I’m going to close here, we should not neglect that this formulation in the tradition connects, immediately and without sharp borders between, to Judgemnt and Action.
So much for the Stanley Fishes of the world, and the temporary ascendacy of technical definition: surely history teaches us, if anything, that narrow ‘technical’ theories of who we are– and indeed, of what ‘techne’ and ‘technology’ are– “shall pass” and become footnotes to the larger stories. Sooner than later, however, I hope, I might add.
I’m sure I’ve bored all of you who, lacking other distraction, have followed my exercise this far: but I might as well take some stab at returning to the question posed (while demonstrating how interlinked the issues are, and how fluid border definitions really are).
“Bonus:” What does all of this have to do with the Gifford Committee and the end of Row House dining?
“Super-Bonus:” (for true geeks): relate to the entity called the “neuron” and the language of modern neuropsychology, with concrete contemporary scientific issues mixed with historical reference, appropriate Williams “hooks,” and passing reference to global conflict; (OR:) (less points awarded) Who created the term “neuron” and what does this have to do with the security structure of Europe in the 19th, 20th, and 21st centuries? Explain in depth, with appropriate hooks into musical and art theory as necessary to adequately explain the question.
October 10th, 2008 at 8:49 pmSoph Mom says:
Ken,
Phew… LOL!
Methinks those professors taught you well…and may ‘rue the day’ once they see this post.
As for “Bonus question” #1?
Alas, I lack the Ephian history and experience, to provide a proper answer to this one.
And “Bonus question” #2?
I’m working on it. My first reaction was that it might be some sort of analogy based on ‘neuron behavior’ vs professors and their departments, but that doesn’t work at all for the last two parts of the question.
However, before I attempt to seriously tackle this..ahem…
‘assignment’ (my lack of a Williams education, notwithstanding)…
I want to know…’What’s the prize?’
:-P
October 10th, 2008 at 9:54 pmkthomas says:
Soph Mom,
At least one member of the audience is not overly bored with my self-exercise. Please remember that, given my truly boring self-absorption, a good deal of the above is an exercise in self-mockery and irony: to mock the academy, you have to start with yourself.
The questions above are a little too detailed for qualifying exams– and maybe a point is few people in the US are educated in a way that they could answer them during quals– but other than mocking qualifications, and other than offering you the dubious proposition and odds of spending a few years or more trying to satisfy committee members (which I can’t offer of my own), perhaps I could bike over to the TRP offices above Amerigo’s and st… er, acquire a few Tennessee for McCain pens, complete with Sarah Palin swimming in the deep waters of actual questions, for (the obvious plethora) of contestants about to proffer answers to the above?
I’ve fiddled with the idea of forcing changes such as those represented in the UCSC report through the Cal system by legislative fiat: it would certainly make me an interesting set of enemies, but one needs good enemies. The other option would be to form some sort of coalition among the second-and-third-tier LACs– begin to found new, small institutions and tear off enrollments from the “mass education” universities– and hope to trickle up to the “first tier.” I don’t see a strategy for reversing course at the first-tier LACs, but to twist Bethany McLean a bit, persistence and experimentation may be a better strategy than logic. Tim Burke is also right in pointing out that the economics of the thing are key: but if you look at the European system, it’s remarkably lean in comparison, and that’s because it doesn’t have the infrastructural costs Tim reflects on.
And but the times are changing; you remind me that I should check in on the status of Europe’s counsels and their attempts to “standardize” Europe’s diverse systems and and forms of endeavor which won’t fit into such boxes, and that this is an iteration of an old conversation with Ethan Zuckerman– indeed our first conversation– in which we, later with the encouragement of the Deans and many professors, thought of founding a new series of educational institutions, based on Deep Springs’ resurrection of the old Germanic system– that {…}
Enough. All in fun.
October 10th, 2008 at 10:54 pmhwc says:
Ken:
You would enjoy having a beer with Tim Burke. In his Easily Distracted blog, he routinely complains about the arcane specialization in academica. His belief, argued strenuously in faculty meetings, is that liberal arts colleges are uniquely positioned to have generalists on the faculty – professors who can draw connections across departments for students AND who can explain their topics of interest to a lay audience. And, more importantly, who can teach their students to do so, too.
October 10th, 2008 at 11:16 pmSoph Mom says:
Okay…making the connections here, Professor K…
It has to do with auditory and visual perception of a given activity, (as in field work) which in turn brings a deeper understanding…which in turn, is a much more effective process of acquiring knowledge, because it amounts to actually influencing brain cells (neurologically).
Still working on the “historical references” and ”
Williams hooks”. A bit hampered in that regard…
As far as a passing reference to “global conflicts” (and/or the possible advantages that WNY might provide in that regard)… Couldn’t it be said, that a school like Williams, which purports to embrace a ‘global world view’, and ‘international diversity’… should at the very least, maintain a “WNY” for the opportunity it might provide to international students to better understand the ‘culture’, and ‘career environment’ of the US…which would also encourage better global relations once those students take that understanding out into the world?
As for the “less points awarded” segment, and the “Wikipedia” type question of who created the term “neuron”…. if I get a second wind, I may take that bait.
October 10th, 2008 at 11:20 pmSoph Mom says:
Ken,
While you posted #6, I was ‘formulating’ #8…
Perhaps I shouldn’t have taken the ‘assignment’ seriously?
No matter…it was fun.
October 10th, 2008 at 11:23 pmkthomas says:
SophMom: “There are many forms and facets,” a stodgy Oxford tutor might have replied; and you bring us to a few other points in this ‘area’ of conversation.
“Fieldwork” — whether in sociology or the other disciplines where that terms is used for the underlying activities of research into the actual conditions of “the world” (stop me before I talk about objects and objectivity)– and specifically as developed in roughly “the Chicago school” and forward– does indeed bring us to what I would call “cognition and cognitive models,” and which you express in terms of building artistic perception and understanding.
We might pause to describe the process of developing an “ear–” and that the ability to perceive (recognize) — and reproduce or palatize– certain sounds and phonemes is a learned behavior, and a very complex process: in brief, far more complex that rote “memorization,” a process that is influenced by both deep biology (can you pallate form the trilled ‘r’ in certain languages)– and that, in a complex mix of biology and culture, genetics and behavior, this process shifts and alters from generation to generation. Ah– wonderful life!
Artistic perception and its bio-cultural transmission: far more complex. But to touch on one of the possible hooks above: Goethe was one of those to take up the claim that to understand art and architecture, you have to travel to Italy to study the remains of the classical examples– there is no possible substitute for their actuality, for exposure to their unreplicable, irreducable reality. They can be re-presented, they can be mimicked– the “reproduction” of the Parthenon 700 feet away from me now is indeed impressive and valuable– but it cannot, ever, have the effect of the presence of the original.
Replicants and Blade Runner aside.
Speaking of replication and diving to the side of the semiotics above: it is amazing that an exposure to a bee-sting as a child– which transfers a virus-like strand of tRNA to all the child’s cells– coupled with a chemical exposure later in life– can so alter a person’s biological systems, that a minor exposure to similar (and some dissimilar) chemical (patterns) can provoke a reaction we call “allergic”– even a life-threatening one for the organism.
These are “learned” responses: the tRNA stores memory (experience) and provokes response in the bee: and it is almost devilish that a bee can transfer such memory experience to another bee– far more devilish that a bee sting can also affect who we are as humans. Think of this the next time you think of yourself as ‘your self–’ in that stodgy Cartesian sense!– you’re actually, perhaps, on a deep biological level, part of that been that stung you in kindergarten– and the next bee who stings you can change who you are, your reactions and perceptions!
In terms of “learning” and “education,” Walter Freeman (who is relatively obscure; he should publish that book I wrote for him!, if any of us still have a copy) was my mentor in the neurological field (not to give any hints:) behind this, I know something of his collaboration with Searle and their encounter with Merleau-Ponty (at about the same time Judith Butler was working through M-P).
I’m not sure any of them are very accessible: Walter is rather odd and begins sentences with a noun, follows with what could be a verb clause but could alternatively be a nominative; and then follows with another ambiguous verbal/nominative clause (and so forth). I sure had enough difficultly understanding the tapes and transcripts of his presentations: I have no idea how his and Searle’s undergrads made it through.
In any case, this is part of an extension of what Merleau-Ponty called “circular learning:” and since M-P is also rather inaccessible (I mean that he’s dead, as well as that he may be hard to read), I’ll give a sort of example: let’s say you want to learn to catch a ball. You don’t simply read a procedure manual on how to catch a ball– you could, but it wouldn’t impart the capacity or skill– you try to catch a ball, you fail.
It would be nice to have a graph here, but the general process is that you move from A to B— ball in air, ball in hand– and back to A again. Each time you repeat the process, every part changes– you change– your neural pathways rearrange– and (oh we’re verging on von Uexkuell and the creation of ‘Environmentalism’ here!) the ball changes too, because what you are about to do is different; the ball can’t be see “with sharp borders” as separate from its surroundings.
The point is that this is not an A “to” B, simple referential process, and learning is not simply imparting facts (or simple technical abilities). It’s repetitive and iterative, but there’s more to it than this; and while I think I once explained this OK in what I wrote for Walter, I don’t think I’ve got it here.
Another example is a parent learning, for instance, to detect their child straying into the street into the path of a car– and trying to rush to grab them. No matter how much the parent cognitively “wants”– as an abstract principle– to rush in front of the car to save their child, there is no guarantee it will happen the first time. Some parents will be instinctively too afraid of the car to act– also a learned response– others will be too slow, meaning that their neural reaction times will not be quick enough to get their body in front of the car and to the child.
After a year or two of responding to such incidents, the parents brain will rearrange– the time to initiate a response will move from a few seconds or more, to hundreds millseconds– eventually, this can be turned into a “precognitive” response, where in tens of milliseconds, the parent’s body will be in motion before the parent’s mind has formed any “cognitive” perception of the danger.
Think of it this way: the parent will move from cognition– rational perception of the event and “understanding” in that manner– followed by adrenaline and a need for thought, analysis and motion– to motion follows by adrenaline, and cognitive perception and though– well, in the best-case, after the child is in-arms and the parent out of the way of the car.
I’m not getting to the core of things here without reference to the techne of neurobiology (which I had for Freeman) or graphs, but the core is something like this: instead of being an a “A to B” mapping, “learn this,” recognition and cognition and are highly circular “practices.” I don’t learn what a soda can is (in kindergarden); I learn a vague approximation of the form of a soda can, and I learn to refine my “map” and recognition of a soda can over my life.
“This is not a pipe,” as the picture is subtitled, and my idea of a soda can is not a “soda can” and there is no abstract, ideal soda can. Rather, my cognitive “representation” of a soda can is rather a sort of circular sum (iteration) of all my experiences of a “soda can” in my life– and, most, most interestingly — at a neural, biological level, my representation and idea of “a soda can” or “a pipe” is absolutely different from yours– and from any other being’s.
Technically, what I am saying is that each of our neural networks– our arrangements of neurons– is utterly unique, and incomparable to the patterns and “representations” inside the brain of any other being. We use words– “a pipe”– as an odd medium beween us to express a common sense of “a pipe”– but in fact this a purely constructed, social, and conventional arrangement– and rather sloppy. Your idea of a pipe is still quite different than mine; and whether we agree or disagree about all of this, this dis-connection is hard-wired on a very basic, even pre-biological level.
This is Walter Freeman’s great contribution to the self-understanding — a contribution that will surely one day be understood beyond his passing technical achievements– beyond the layer of sense-perception, beyond all the appartuses, biological and technical– what’s going on inside quite different for each individual. Whatever a pipe is, whatever “love” is, whatever a child is and whatever our memories of them are– it’s remarkably unique for each of us, percieved differently, encoded differently– and what “a child” is, is, rather than a simple definition or identity or “logical coupula” (sans sexual reference)– more, for each of us, a sum of our paths and encounters and thoughts on “a child;” all our individual memories and experience of specific moments in historical time.
Call this “deep historicism;” I’ll have to differ with Walter Kaufmann on this, I believe, (without reviewing Kaufmann et al).
I wish I had time to conduct a shorter and cleared step back to Kant’s formulation of this in his Inaugural Dissertation (and the conversation with Leibniz et al): the assertion that “individuals” (persons– but all “irreducable and separate and utterly different ‘monads’) and planets and atoms are all the sum of the “experience” of their interactions with the (forces) of others (‘objects’ or ’subjects’; Gegensaetze): the wonderful and complex and deeply religious expression Kant gives there– which underlies all of this modern thread of the great conversation— that “we are each, utterly unique, and incomparable creations of G-d.”
October 11th, 2008 at 12:40 amkthomas says:
SophMom: same for #10/#9. No problem; {…}
October 11th, 2008 at 1:06 amSoph Mom says:
Ken,
Have you done any teaching? If not, you ought to consider it. Honestly. What a beautiful commentary on learning… as well as a tribute to all that is magical and mysterious about the human experience.
Given the kind of behavior that is currently being exhibited, (within this election format), and the results of less-than-admirable character coming to fruition ( the financial fiasco), your reminder that we are all in possession of at least a drop of God’s magic, is a gift…Thank you.
A couple of asides:
When I was learning Spanish as a child, I remember very clearly the ‘moment’ when weeks of effort, combined in just the right way with tongue and palate and teeth, to roll the “r” correctly. And once I had it, it was there to stay!
And as for bees? Suffice to say that I have recognized that wasps and I have developed a rather undesirable ‘interconnectivity’ in the last couple of years. I have been swarmed and stung several times..even twice in a two-week period. I suppose they don’t like the havoc my garden hose wreaks…but it does seem ‘personal’… as if they make more of a ‘beeline’ for me than most other humans!
October 11th, 2008 at 1:39 amkthomas says:
hwc: I don’t make it to Tim’s blog nearly as much as I’d like, but I enjoy his thoughts greatly when I do.
A brief follow-up to some of the above: we often act as if academia were insulated from the market and politics; I find quite the opposite, and that if we’re finally asking questions about executive salaries– it may be time to ask questions about the highest tier of professorial salaries and what has occured– and the price paid.
I’m not going to go further tonight, and I probably should review my contacts and understanding before doing so– but (given we also have connections) intentionally hitting Stanley Fish with statements I’d otherwise defer. He’s a big boy and can certainly take anything I can throw– for now– but more importantly, I think he deserves it, to be asked to resign several positions, and to pay back some of the unabashed loot he’s garnered under the assertion that “morality and character” have no place…
October 11th, 2008 at 2:22 amSoph Mom says:
Ken,
Just re-reading this thread…(I so love these kinds of discussions, unequipped though I may be, to truly understand and contribute to them)
However (!), I find myself thinking about the section where you talk about our different interpretations of things (and experiences?) per “techne of neurobiology”, (can and pipe).
If…our interpretations, and representations of ’something’ can be so very different one from another, then couldn’t it be said, that any attempt to condense our experience, and in turn, communicate it… through art, music, words, etc…is a fairly big accomplishment? That the term ‘universal truth’ has much more complexity than most think? That even the simple little phrase, “I see what you mean”, covers huge distances in terms of neuron activity between the two people arriving at that understanding?
Cetainly puts a different spin on the accomplishment of ‘conveying understanding’….and fairly elevates the artist/communicator who does it well.
After all…so many neurons, so little time!!!
October 11th, 2008 at 11:56 am