Wed 11 Nov 2009
Dulce et Decorum Est
Posted by David under Trustees, Veterans Admissions, Wick Sloane '76 at 12:00 pm
Wick Sloane ‘76 wrote the following e-mail to 5 trustees:
Greg and Steve and Clayton and Paul and Bill –
The absence of Iraq and Afghanistan veterans at Williams is disgraceful. I’ve brought this to your attention before, without result. Hammering me, the messenger, is petty. I’m long dead, anyway, but fire away if that makes you feel better. There are now hundreds of thousands of veterans collecting GI Bill benefits. Williams can find a few.
Any and all of you are welcome to visit any class of mine at Bunker Hill Community College. I will give you the entire period to rebut my argument that Williams should have veterans enrolled.
I find no pleasure in this broadcast note. I’ve tried the polite way for more than a year with no luck or even credible replies.
ws
http://www.insidehighered.com/views/sloane/sloane30
From the column –
The Devil’s Workshop Highly Selective Veterans Day Survey
Institution Current Undergraduate Veteran Enrollment Yale 0 Princeton 0 Williams 0 Harvard 4 Dartmouth 16 Stanford 30 Bunker Hill
Community College285 (c)Inside Higher Ed
More from Wick’s column:
Cane. Short haircut. Young. Here in a community college, that means “Veteran. Wounded.” I always introduce myself to see what help they need at school. Or perhaps what help I need, because I am so ashamed of what I, the people, have put these veterans through with little result or purpose.
One cane I’ll call Tony I’ve lost altogether. He wasn’t thirty years old. An improvised explosive devise, an IED, in Iraq had caused his wounds, he told me. Brain trauma, which showed in his speech and thinking. The limp was because the IED had broken his neck. In the fog of war, no one had discovered the fracture until he was in a hospital in Germany. Just the effort of walking left him sweating in the lobby. He had his veterans benefits paperwork. A colleague and I made sure he had what he needed and knew the right lines to register. I looked two days later. Tony wasn’t registered. I telephoned. He’d been mugged on the subway. I talked with his father. I offered to drive over and pick Tony up. We couldn’t get Tony back to school. He only wanted to go to community college for job training. Another cane is still in school.
For the sake of these canes, and the coffins, too, how about an assignment for us all this week? Let’s distribute at every meeting and every class we attend this week copies of Wilfred Owen’s World War I poem, “Dulce et Decorum Est.”
Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,
Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs
And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots
But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots
Of tired, outstripped Five-Nines that dropped behind.Gas! Gas! Quick, boys! – An ecstasy of fumbling,
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time;
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling,
And flound’ring like a man in fire or lime . . .
Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light,
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.
In all my dreams, before my helpless sight,
He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.
My best writing on veteran issues are here, here and here.
Happy Veteran’s Day to Ephs far and wide.
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34 Responses to “Dulce et Decorum Est”
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Dick Swart says:
Absolutely! Certainly, at least as important as the time and effort spent on athletic recruiting!
Anthem for Doomed Youth
Wilfred Owen
1893-1918
What passing-bells for these who die as cattle?
Only the monstrous anger of the guns.
Only the stuttering rifles’ rapid rattle
Can patter out their hasty orisons.
No mockeries now for them; no prayers nor bells;
Nor any voice of mourning save the choirs,
The shrill, demented choirs of wailing shells;
And bugles calling for them from sad shires.
What candles may be held to speed them all?
Not in the hands of boys, but in their eyes
Shall shine the holy glimmers of good-byes.
The pallor of girls’ brows shall be their pall;
Their flowers the tenderness of patient minds,
And each slow dusk a drawing-down of blinds.
Ronit says:
Suicide in the Trenches
Siegfried Sassoon
1886-1967
I knew a simple soldier boy
Who grinned at life in empty joy,
Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
And whistled early with the lark.
In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
He put a bullet through his brain.
No one spoke of him again.
You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
Sneak home and pray you’ll never know
The hell where youth and laughter go.
Ken Thomas '93 says:
Waregem.
Steve Wollkind '01 says:
Do we have access to information to let us know whether these veterans are applying to Williams? Is there some sort of selection bias here that causes the population of people who are veterans and the population of people applying to Williams not to overlap much?
I don’t know much about the GI Bill benefits, but do they cover the high cost of a Williams education? If not, does this come into play somehow? I think we need more information before we just blast Williams for not having enough of a certain subset of the population enrolled.
Dick Swart says:
Waregem, the cemetery in Flanders.
In Flanders fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row,
That mark our place; and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.
We are the dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
Loved, and were loved, and now we lie
In Flanders fields.
Take up our quarrel with the foe:
To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.
— Lt.-Col. John McCrae (1872 – 1918)
Derek says:
I’m with Steve. Until we know a lot more about the process it’s hard to call for (ahem) affirmative action for veterans. Which I would support, by the way. But by any definition this is a call for more affirmative action at Williams.
dcat
Ronit says:
@Derek: Not necessarily. If the problem is that there aren’t enough (or any) veterans applying to Williams, could Williams do things to attract veterans and encourage them to apply? The admissions office can do a number of things on the recruitment and marketing side which would not qualify as affirmative action.
In answer to Steve’s question about cost, the post 9/11 GI Bill provides “tuition & fees directly to the school not to exceed the maximum in-state tuition & fees at a public Institution of Higher Learning”, “a monthly housing allowance based on the Basic Allowance for Housing for an E-5 with dependents at the location of the school”, and “an annual books & supplies stipend of $1,000 paid proportionately based on enrollment”.
The maximum in-state tuition and fees for Massachusetts seems to be $17,787.00 per term (I am not sure if they would use this number, or something based on credit hours, which don’t exist at Williams), and the maximum housing allowance for an E-5 without dependents in 01267 is $1088. At any rate, since Williams has generous financial aid policies with a promise of full need being met, I am not sure cost is a deterrent to any veteran who wants to apply. For any veteran where the GI bill is insufficient to pay the full cost of a Williams education, the govt. funds would merely reduce the financial aid Williams would have to provide them. Williams would, in fact, be spending less on veterans than on other financial-aid students.
PTC says:
Derek and Steve- The cost is a matter of law. We already did that math on a previous thread about this issue… where many bloggers expressed doubt that Veterans would fit in at Williams.
The cost is matching funds above the cost of the highest priced state school in the state of mass. About 5k a year for a full ride at Williams. I believe Williams already has that program in place- does it not? Now all the school needs to do, is accept one.
Affirmative action … maybe, if they are given special consideration for acceptance… but isn’t everyone’s background considered when reviewing applications to college?
Yale has been hostile to vets for a long time now… kind of strange seeing a goose egg from such a large school.
What about Amherst- you guys got your rivals numbers?
PTC says:
http://www.ephblog.com/2009/06/18/yellow-ribbon-the-numbers/
Above is the thread where I ran the numbers. Williams can give a veteran a free ride for 5k a year under the new GI bill.
Derek says:
Ronit –
Recruiting any special group because of their group identity is pretty much the definition of affirmative action. And I support affirmatiuve action. But what you described? That’s affirmative action.
PTC –
I had no concerns about cost. I was part of the anti sky is falling brigade lo these many months. Williams can afford to do many things. It could in January when many thought the end was nigh, it can afford to do so now. I literally have no money concerns. But I don’t know enough about the process of vets applying, the rates of acceptance, and so forth.
dcat
Ronit says:
@Derek: Fair enough, but I’ve rarely heard serious objections to recruitment/marketing types of “affirmative action”; most controversies relating to affirmative action have to do with specific quotas or preferences in the actual admissions proces, which, I would point out, is not necessary for Williams to enroll some veterans.
(also, if stronger forms of affirmative action are, on the whole, accepted at Williams, then I too have no objection to applying some preferences to veterans)
rory says:
@Ronit: there are no more “specific quotas” in affirmative action*. controversies do and have come about in regards to recruitment strategies such as special weekend visits. While those have not generally been discontinued, they have been criticized and attacked.
*except maybe international students but they have no standing to bring a court case.
Wick Sloane says:
I gather, reliably but I don’t have permission to quote, that not many veterans apply to Williams. I don’t find that a credible reason or excuse.
Jim Wright, ex-Marine who just retired as president of Dartmouth, just got on a plane and started visiting Walter Reed and other hospitals. Remember that those serving who haven’t yet been to college would be enlisted men and women, not officers. In my experience, these are people who don’t believe or know that scholarships are available in the first place.
These troops are not going to be looking for Williams. Williams has to look for them. Dartmouth has 16 veterans because of 19 visits by Jim Wright to military hospitals and because he has gotten the word out. There is a student at Dartmouth now who applied from Anbar province in Iraq. Between missions.
Amherst has one veteran.
Here is Greg’s reply, by the way, copied to the others. This just makes me sad for Williams. My several polite inquiries to trustees over the years on this issue were blown off.
On Nov 10, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Avis, Gregory M. wrote:
Wick,
Thank you for reminding us on the eve of Veterans’ Day about this issue.
As you know, we are in a presidential transition, and I will be certain to raise the issue with Adam when he arrives. It would be interesting to learn of his experience at Hopkins on this matter.
While you are undoubtedly frustrated, please be patient. I frankly think a less inflammatory approach is likely to get a better reception.
Best,
Greg
Ronit says:
@rory: I don’t want to rehash affirmative action here. I am familiar with the Bollinger cases. The use of racial preferences during the admissions evaluation process remains constitutional, and also far more controversial than the use of recruitment/marketing tactics aimed at encouraging a more diverse applicant pool.
(I think it would be best to focus on what Wick is suggesting instead of trying to debate the meaning of more and less defensible forms of affirmative action.)
PTC says:
Derek- Wick has this right- Williams would need to recruit veterans to draw capable students. Other institutions that have long standing relationships with the military have an “in” that Williams lacks. Most of this is due to the strong relationship some ivies have with active duty members in graduate programs. Harvard always has active duty people there in grad programs, it is a long standing tradition, especially at the Kennedy School, and of course… Dartmouth.
In short- if Williams does not attempt to make the place attractive for veterans who can get in- they will not get any students.
PTC says:
and one has to wonder… how diverse in opinion is a college that has no Veterans in it when we have been fighting two wars for nearly a decade?
What about faculty? Are there any OIF/ OEF veterans on the faculty? I would think finding a hire would be fairly easy.
Phil says:
Williams needs to be proactive in this situation and reach out to the vets. They will never find us on their own and if we are as good as we say we are, we should be a leader not a follower in finding qualified applicants.
There should be a veterans information page on the admissions office website, veterans oriented literature for distribution through the VA, outreach programs to VA hospitals, visits to community colleges like Bunker Hill, admissions assistance programs to help with the paperwork, special scholarships for veterans, a veterans person in the admissions office, etc., etc.
Wouldn’t it be wonderful to have a donor or group of donors step up and establish a veterans scholarship fund THIS FALL as part of the Alumni Fund Drive???!!!
We can not and should not sit on our rear ends waiting for the arrival and acclimation of a new president. We owe our vets far more than that, far more, and we owe it to them starting now!
I am told that we lost 58,000 killed in Viet Nam but so far there have been 102,000 Viet Nam vet suicides.
I am a Viet Nam vet and I am incensed at the lackadaisical approach I see reflected in the responses from the college.
frank uible says:
Williams has had at least one felon, consequently it ought to have at least two or three vets for the sake of diversity.
kthomas says:
@Phil: You do not mention your connection or if you are a former Williams student or otherwise (though you do not need to be; you use “we.”)
Waregem or Bastogne were my alternate destinations for today. Waregem is a reasonable walk from home, and I was sorry not to be there to see and observe, the thoughts and rituals of a people who are still deeply appreciative and grateful to the United States.
Though I have seen that elsewhere in the past days. I also saw a bit of neo-Nazism among the youth in Cologne today, amid their celebrations, which was sobering.
Do we celebrate this day in the United States, the way it is celebrated in Europe?
But, in any case– Williams as Williams is very unlikely to do anything on this issue, “inflammatory or not.” What President Falk will do– I will not presume to comment on, but– my first version of this was “Williams will no do anything here,” and what comes to mind is “please, Greg, take some responsibility on yourself and don’t push this off on someone else (etc).”
Generally the interesting thing about the Germans is that many of them are now very proactive in handling situations and taking responsibility for the consequences. What’s the right level of inflammation and phrasing for me to point out that I find Greg’s response to be inadequate to the point of my losing confidence in him and questioning his authority, position, and … oh, I’ll hold my insults for now. For now.
But opinions should have consequences and if someone like Greg thinks it appropriate to respond as above, then they should face those consequences. And only we can do something to make sure that occurs.
That was a sort of threat, though it’s really up to the alumni to back that sort of threat up.
But anyway. Speaking of which. We can assume that people like Greg are not going to act, because… as I’ve said, I have no confidence and respect I may have given, dwindles when I read such a response.
But anyway. Speaking of which.
If anything is going to happen here, it’s going to be us. It’s going to be the alumni. Absent President Falk — in whom I have full and deepest confidence– taking action– President Falk is going to have a lot on his plate.
So it’s going to be us, the alumni. Maybe we have to fly to Walter Reed, or Vanderbilt Medical and the 101st. Maybe we have to track down veterans who would qualify for Williams.
If we don’t do it, nothing is going to happen.
It will not be convenient for me– but I’m willing to do something. More than something.
Who else? Is there someone else here who’s willing to make this happen, whatever it takes? Draw up a list of preliminary steps and action items? Form a working body or committee?
If not, we should all just shut up, because we’re wasting our breath.
Phil says:
Williams, ‘63. LTjg, USNR, retired.
PTC says:
Ken- One simple thing you could do is to reach out to one of the many military associations. You could offer a full scholarship with the stipulation that the person was a veteran and qualified. Without school involvement in terms of acceptance… not sure how far that will get you. Also… I believe that the matching fund already gives a veteran close to a free ride.
One of the biggest concerns on this topic during previous threads was age. People doubted that Williams would be good for a 22-24 year old freshman… If the school will not accept older applicants then every scholarship offer in the world is not going to get a qualified veteran into the school. I think suspect is a pretty large hurdle here…
Phil says:
I agree, it is up to us so count me in.
I am a class agent and can contact the Annual Fund people about the scholarship idea.
I also suggest we support Wick in his efforts to get somebody from Williams to visit Bunker Hill Community College. He has been trying to get somebody to come for well over a year and gotten nowhere. Such a visit would be a real start and perhaps an opportunity to generate some momentum and interest.
We can also spread the word to other alumni through our individual networks. I would love to have every member of my class read Wick’s column and look at the numbers.
We can also send it to other people. I sent the column to over 90 of my former shipmates on the USS Ponchatoula urging them to support a cleanup of the veterans mess.
Momentum is everything…
Wick Sloane says:
kthomas —
I’ll put anyone in touch with Jim Wright, of Dartmouth, and Jim Selbe, who is with the impressive initiative for veterans by the American Council on Education. They will help. I am helping veterans at Bunker Hill Community College. I mean helping them apply to four-year schools, including Vassar thanks to the help of a Williams alum who works there.
I just don’t see how we can be a nation at war and not reach out in any way we can. I don’t see how an institution can make aggressive use of federal funds and benefits — all legal I admit — as Williams does and yet not reach out to these men and women. I sent my column to Sen. Kerry asking whether colleges and universities with no undergraduate veterans should be eligible for federal aid at all.
I think Phil, ‘63, Ltjg, USNR, retired, a dear friend, would be part of an effort, though I leave it to him here to share the balance of his name.
I agree action will have to come from outside and that Greg Avis’s handoff is pretty sad. I would go to Walter Reed, or elsewhere, but in my case that feel symbolic since I already have 285 veterans at Bunker Hill Community College. I just mean that I will continue to do something in addition to words.
If Ephblog could send, as it did, 2,000 books to Noah at the Pine Ridge Reservation, I’ll bet we can bring ten veterans to Williams each year, for a start. Why not?
Wick Sloane says:
P.S. Age of veterans
The student of mine from Bunker Hill, now at Dartmouth, is 26 and beginning his sophomore year. He drove a tank in Iraq and is a Oglala Sioux, from Pine Ridge, the same reservation where Ephblog sent 2,000 books. These men and women will figure out the age issue on their own.
John by his own choice entered Dartmouth as a freshman without trying to jury rig any other credits. Dartmouth gives veterans a choice of housing with other older students or in regular dorms. John chose to live with other veterans. Another, John’s age or older, chose a freshman dorm. That veteran thought he’d meet more people in a regular dorm. On age, John’s simple point, which I can’t quote exactly — “I’ve had an awful education. If I can spend four years at a place like Dartmouth, I’m going to do just that.” John plans to be a high school teacher and principal back in Pine Ridge.
Age is an issue these veterans can decide on their own. Just as high school/prep school students looking for college do — some will like a small, liberal arts college, some will prefer Cal Berkeley.
PTC says:
wick- My point is, I do not think Williams is open to age diversity. That hurts these applicants.
Bloggers here have argued against ROTC on campus in the past, using DADT as the reason. Bloggers have also argued against Veterans admission because they felt a need for special services and age specifically, would be disqualifying.
Ephlbog has tackled this and similar topic many times in the past. This is the first time I have seen a “pro veterans at Williams” stance “winning” on the blog.
Ronit says:
@PTC: Needless to point out, winning on this blog is about as useful as the proverbial pissing into the wind. But if some of the people posting here want to use Ephblog as part of an effort to reach out to veterans and increase awareness about Williams (and its financial aid policies), that would be pretty awesome.
Matt Draheim says:
I agree with the general sentiment here. Reaching out to veterans would help enrich the academic experience at the college and could provide valuable insight into many of the political and geopolitical discussions had on campus. I am fairly confident that there are qualified veterans who could provide such a boost to the educational experience at Williams. Furthermore, as previously noted it shouldn’t be an issue for financial aid to accommodate them.
As a recent graduate and newly minted alum I can’t do much in the way of establishing a scholarship fund, but I can and will plug the Williams experience to every unit with which I serve in the coming years. There are a number of alums currently serving, a resource that could be used to help spread the word that veterans are encouraged to apply.
Matt Draheim ‘09
US Army DEP/OCS
PTC says:
Matt- Thanks for your service man. I do not think a scholarship is needed. Williams already has a policy to match the GI Bill with enough money or almost enough money to pay a full ride.
Are there any profs who are Veterans of OIF or OEF?
Ronit- True, but I have a feeling that age has something to do with zero admissions. If Williams really wants to get Veterans to attend, they are going to have to admit more older students.
PTC says:
Now that this thread has run it’s course I feel the need to correct “yet again another example” of a person passing on the common false representation of military people being “generally poor”. Written in the thread below the linked article written by Prof Sloane is as good a response as any. Please take note:
Military members are not “generally poor”. Military casualties generally represent the demographics of our society with the exception of under representation of the very wealthy and a slight over representation of the white middle class. This has been common since we had an integrated Army… even during Vietnam when we had a draft.
Remember- 97% of the people serving have graduated high school. Over 25% of enlisted personnel in the more elite combat units and the more academically orineted fields already have college degrees. Career Officers at or above the rank of 0-4 normally have advanced degrees from some of the best schools in the nation. It is important that we recognize the demographic that we are talking about in these discussions, and not fall victim to the “liberal” misconceptions and misrepresentations of service demographics.
Wick Sloane says:
Matt, thank you from here, too.
Ronit is correct to remind us that agreements on blog don’t accomplish much. None of the other trustees replied. Read a smile — experience has proven to the trustees that ignoring me works just fine. No interview for me for the Williams presidency, for example….
Suggestion for something to do —
We could decide here that ten veterans per class is something to aim for. Neither Iraq nor Afghanistan seem to be ending soon.
Write/email the trustees a short, courteous note with your view of why this issue is important. Post a copy of your note here. Activism 101 shows that sunlight helps, especially when when the bosses are stonewalling.
Find some veterans and do anything you can to help them with their education. Williams is just one option, and an unlikely one, now, at that.
So what? What’s the point of my (trustees would say adolescent) rant against my betters on the Williams board? We’ve all seen the data. Less than one percent of the population serves in the military. Fewer than five percent of the population even know anyone serving. Ten veterans per class is huge for those individuals but tiny in the great scheme of things. Except that we are talking about Williams. Symbolism counts. Williams acting for veterans will gain attention and increase the number of people thinking about these wars. Perhaps a Williams education somewhere will contribute to a better solution than these wars. If young people with canes and brain trauma are appearing in the lobby at Bunker Hill Community College, we all have work to do.
PTC says:
Wick- Why don’t you mentor a couple of your better students and help them submit an application to Williams? It would carry a lot more weight if you were able to say- “why did’nt you admit John Smith?” Do you have students that qualify that would like to go?
… that makes Williams feel direct pressure and would expose rejection. Make it public.. post it here. Soup to nuts… starting with this coming academic year.
Phil says:
And in this morning’s Honolulu Advertiser, I see that Oklahoma’s GOP senator Tom Coburn has chosen the week of Veterans Day to single handedly block the bill for new benefits for vets. Many of the blocked reforms are meant to improve the quality, availability and delivery of health care to veterans. He says he is opposed to any unfunded spending.
In the last two days, I have received several e-mail alerts from national organizations about this bozo. I am glad to see that he is now being outed in the national media.
BTW, I think PTC’s idea in #31 is excellent. We need a poster person!
Wick Sloane says:
PTC —
Regarding mentoring students for Williams. It wouldn’t be fair to the student. Williams is not interested in these students at the moment. I stopped asking the admissions office to visit. Most freshmen admitted at Williams stay. Transfer slots usually open up because people leave, and Williams and others don’t need to refill slots along the way. Williams admits people as freshmen and does give plenty of scholarships then. Same at, for example, Yale, Princeton and Harvard.
Bunker Hill has students at Amherst, Dartmouth, Hamilton, Smith, Columbia. These colleges do, as a policy, make room for such students. For transfers, the odds of admission are even more formidable than as a freshman. Community college students, the ones I deal with, have already difficult lives. I find it’s best to direct them to where there is hope.
PTC says:
Wick- Man, you seem like a great guy… and being a veteran myself I really appreciate your passion in this matter… but that strikes me as a really weak response.
Williams is a great school, and if you prepared someone to go they could get into the other places that are more friendly as a backup, without risking a thing or wasting much time at all.
I think that answer is pretty weak honestly. If you cannot show a specific case where Williams has discriminated against someone because of age and/or service… you really weaken your argument.
Bottom line- If you have a capable veteran student who would like Williams, why not find out if he or she can get in? You risk nothing and push important policy.
“Show me the money”…
or in this case “show me the student”.